Disclaimer: 
This rough edit transcript, which may contain missing, misspelled or paraphrased words, is only provided for your immediate review and is not certified as verbatim and is not to be cited in any way.
National Disability Institute 
#ABLEtoSave 
August 27, 2021 
1:30 p.m. - 3:00 p.m. EST.

[ Captioner standing by ]

>> MIRANDA: Hi, everyone.
We will be getting started here in a little bit.
Okay?
Laurie and Brian, we'll get ourselves on mute.
And I'll get connected with Katie to see if she can pull us back into a practice session.
I don't know if we can.
But we'll try.
>> INSTRUCTOR: We're just doing a quick session with our Sign Language interpreters and panelists here.
So you're getting a quick preview if you're here early.
The Sign Language interpreters that are signed in today, I made both of you co-hosts.
As you switch turns signing, can you spotlight each other?
Spot your own spotlight and whoever is shifting towards being the person who's signing, can you sign?
And hit spotlight.
Rhonda, I think you were with us last week when you were with us.
Would that work for you?
>> RONDA:  I just stop my video?
Is that what I do and she will spotlight for everyone?
My teamer?
>> MIRANDA: So, yeah.
What you would do is you would hit "spotlight" for everyone on yourself if you're starting to sign.
And then once you stop and the other Sign Language interpreter starts --
>> RONDA:  I see them.
>> MIRANDA: And you should be able to spotlight yourself and then stop spotlighting yourself.
And I'll manage the other spotlights for myself and whoever else is speaking during the panel.
Okay?
>> RONDA:  Okay.
All right.
>> MIRANDA: Thank you.
Hello, everyone.
We'll be getting started in just a few minutes.
So thanks for being here.
And we'll get started soon.
[ RECORDING IN PROGRESS ]
>> MIRANDA: Hello, everyone.
And thank you for joining us today.
We are here today with the ABLE National Resource Center.
It is part of our ABLE to Save events.
Today we're talking to our subject matter experts about best practices for ABLE family members.
This week --
>> Hi!
>> MIRANDA: -- is sponsored by ABLE Now and ABLE America.
I'm going to go ahead and ask everyone to put yourselves on mute.
If you are not on mute and you're a panelist, that is.
And we're going to go ahead and get started.
My name is Miranda Kennedy.
I'm the Director of the ABLE National Resource Center.
And I'm really glad you're all here with us.
I want to get started by letting you know that there's some information about how to listen to our panel discussion and our Q&A session here today.
Today's discussion can be accessed using computer audio or by calling in by phone.
If you select "computer audio," please make sure your speakers are turned on or your headphones are plugged in.
If you do not have sound capabilities on your computer or prefer to listen by phone, you can dial 1-877-853-5257.
The code is 874 6535-6748.
We also have captioning and American Sign Language interpretation provided.
Our realtime captioning provided can be found by clicking on the closed caption icon in your Zoom controls at the bottom of the screen.
You also will be able to see along with the panelists, where we have American Sign Language interpretation as well.
And they'll be spotlighting their screen throughout.
If you do not see the captions by clicking the button or the American Sign Language interpreters on the screen, you can alert the host via the chat box.
And we can support you with that.
And in terms of our panel recording and any technical issues, we want to let you know that if you miss portions of today's Q&A session, it is being recorded and it will be placed on the ABLE National Resource Center's ABLE to Save web page at ablenrc.org/abletosave-2021.
And that is going to be a web page you all will want to have because all the materials this month can be found on that web page on our website.
Including the recordings of our live events.
If you have any technical issues, please let us know in the chat box.
Or you can send a message to our host.
Or you can e-mail Katie Auchenbach at NDI.
And her e-mail is kauchenbach@ndi-inc.org.
We are going to limit the chat box.
We're not going to be taking questions in the chat box.
But if you need assistance along those lines, you can use the chat box for that or e-mail us.
So with that, I'll introduce myself again and our panel of experts, my colleagues and our ambassadors and our guests who are joining us today.
My name is Miranda Kennedy.
I'm the director of the ABLE National Resource Center, National Disability Institute.
I'm here with my colleagues Laurie Schaller and Brian Ingram.
Laurie is a subject matter expert and a manager of financial empowerment at National Disability Institute.
She's a certified work and center coordinator and an expert on assistive technology and runs an assistive technology loan program with us as well.
Brian Ingram is an ABLE and Disability Employment subject matter expert.
He's new to our team and a parent of an ABLE account owner.
He'll be sharing information about that as well.
Laurie and Brian will be responding to questions in the Q&A as well as joining us on our panel.
So you'll be hearing from them on both mediums.
We also have with us today as our panelists, Davinna Christian joining us.
I'll check with Katie, my colleague, to see if we have Davinna synced up.
>> KATIE:  Yes.
Davinna is on the line and she should be able to mute and unmute herself and participate in the conversation.
>> MIRANDA: And thank you for being here despite no WiFi and storms in Michigan.
So you can tell, passionate about the message of ABLE accounts, persevering through extreme weather to be here.
Thanks for being with us, Davinna.  She's been an ABLE NRC ambassador since 2019.
She's the mother of a 22-year-old ABLE account owner in Detroit, Michigan, where she's having severe weather right now.
We're grateful to Davinna Christian joining us.
We also have Cheryl Walfall-Flagg who is an ABLE NRC ambassador and mother of a 19-year-old ABLE account owner and a guardian of a 14-year-old ABLE account owner in Charlotte, North Carolina.
We also have Joanne Marcus, who is President and C.E.O. of Commonwealth Community Trust.
And she is a master's degree in social work and serves as the President and C.E.O. of Commonwealth Community Trust.
And at Commonwealth Community Trust, she served as executive director for 20 some years before being named President and C.E.O. 
So we're glad to have her here as well.
And many may have seen the blog of Commonwealth Community Trust on pooled trusts that went out on Tuesday.
So thank you for joining us as well.
So for those of you who may be joining us for the first time, ABLE National Resource Center, we are the leading comprehensive source of objective, independent information about federal and state-related ABLE programs and activities, including guidance on tax-advantaged ABLE savings accounts.
It really is our mission to educate, promote, and support the positive impact that ABLE can make on the millions of lives of Americans with disabilities.
At National Resource Center, we don't run the programs but serve as an outreach mechanism.
And we share best practices, strategies, tools that can be used.
And we encourage you to check out our website, ablenrc.org if you haven't already.
And thank you for joining us on our campaign.
And let me tell you on our campaign.
You may have been with us the whole time.
And if so, welcome back.
But this is to provide resources to those that may be new to the ABLE space, those thinking about opening an ABLE account for themselves or helping a family member or someone you're supporting opening an ABLE account and hoping to share information on the ease and use and significance of ABLE accounts in the lives of people with disabilities.
We do want to thank our sponsors for this week, ABLE Now and ABLE America.
We greatly appreciate the sponsorship that they do, and this week in particular.
And I should mention, too, that ABLE Now and ABLE America who are sponsors this week, the blog that Joanne Marcus and Commonwealth Community Trust wrote has an ABLE account.
So, I'll give you some highlights of what we're doing this month and what we're doing now in the last full week of the month.
Throughout this month, we've been hosting events, sharing ABLE tools, including panels with our ABLE ambassadors and subject level experts.
We've shared podcasts, informational videos.
We've done Q&A sessions like we've done today.
Hope you check out all those materials on our web page on the 2021 ABLE to Save month.
The first week, we did a welcome.
The second week was about opening an ABLE account and keys to success.
Last week, we talked about best practices for eligible individuals and working age adults.
And this week really is about best practices for ABLE family members and circle of support.
Next week on Monday, we're going to be meeting with our full panel of ABLE account ambassadors for this year talking about our ABLE call to action and what next steps to take.
But let's dive into our discussion today on best practices for ABLE family members and circle of support.
With that, I'm actually going to -- oh!
I want to touch base really quickly.
As we're get into our panel, submitting questions.
We do ask that you use the Q&A box and not the chat to submit those questions.
We'll try to get to as many questions as we can.
Frequently we get many different versions on the same questions.
So we may combine those because we can only really give more general information and answers to questions that aren't specific to more case management and where there's multi parts to a question.
The reason we don't get into the more in depth questions is because if we're missing a piece of that puzzle, we may unintentionally give the wrong guidance.
And we do not want to do that.
However, we can answer many of the questions that you might have.
And that's what we're here for.
Do want to let you know, if your family member is a transition age youth or working age adult, they can get free benefits advisement from a work incentive planning assert, WIPA at choosework.ssa.gov.
And if your family member is an account owner, they can get help for their state specific ABLE program.
So with that, let's go ahead and I'm going to stop sharing the PowerPoint.
And I'm going to share and highlight -- hi, everyone.
I'm going to bring in just right as we're getting started.
I'm going to start off with my colleague Brian who wears lots of different hats.
Brian, you're not just an ABLE subject matter expert.
You're also disability employment expert.
And you're also ....
>> BRIAN:  I'm also a parent of a young man who has an ABLE account.
So you're right, Miranda.
My name's Brian Ingram.
I'm very happy to be here.
I work for the National Disability Institute.
And I am new to the ABLE team.
But I have been around a long time.
I come from -- most my background is around employment with folks with disabilities.
And the reason I was really excited to join the ABLE team and become a part of this effort is I have a 20-year-old son who has an ABLE account.
And I've really been able to see firsthand how adding an ABLE account and the tools and strategies we're using to help transition him into adulthood has been, A, very effective and B, kind of filled a gap in supports that would have existed had the ABLE account not been there.
So again, I'm really happy to be here.
And I'm excited to be a part of this panel.
>> MIRANDA: I want to ask you just one quick question before you dive into answering some of the questions in the Q&A, Brian.
We were talking about this right before we started the panel today.
And we were saying, what would you go back and tell a slightly younger version of Brian about ABLE accounts and what to consider doing?
>> BRIAN:  One of the things that I realized when I joined the ABLE team was that we could have assisted our kid opening an ABLE account when he was a lot of younger than he is now.
And that ABLE account could have really helped him.
One of the things we've done with it, Miranda -- or he's done with it -- is he has actually used his ABLE account to help fund, train, and keep a service dog.
And so that's something that would have been really challenging to do, you know, with some of the means tested benefits he was receiving without that ABLE account.
It's been -- you know, that right there is enough to have totally impacted his life in a positive way and to have changed it.
And we could've gotten started with that a lot earlier had I known that.
>> MIRANDA: Not earlier than 2016 when the first ABLE program was open.
Don't pick on yourself too much.
>> BRIAN:  That's true.
>> MIRANDA: Not something ten years ago but yes five.
Thank you so much, Brian.
I'm going to go ahead now.
And we'll jump all across the country from Brian was in Portland, Oregon.
I'm actually going to go ahead and put a spotlight on our ABLE ambassador Cheryl Walfall-Flagg.
Cheryl if you could turn your video on and audio.
And I will put a spotlight on you.
And I'll bring you in to the discussion.
Cheryl, all the way across the country from Oregon.
You're in North Carolina, Cheryl.
Hi!
>> CHERYL: Hi, Miranda.
>> MIRANDA: So similar to Brian, could you introduce yourself to folks and share a little bit about just your story and what you're using your ABLE account for?
Cheryl has been with us since 2018 as an ambassador.
>> CHERYL: My son -- as Miranda said earlier -- is 19 years old.
And we opened his account.
We have an NC ABLE account and I opened that January 27, 2017, the day when the ABLE account was opened in North Carolina.
And my nephew -- my husband's nephew, we are his guardians.
Both his parents passed away.
And so we are his guardians.
And we just recently opened his account.
My husband is his guardian.
My nephew does receive benefits.
He's receiving benefits based on his parents as contributions.
And so we have qualified ABLE account owners in two different categories of qualification.
And like Miranda said, I have been talking about ABLE accounts as early as 2018 because I just believe in the benefit that they offer to our family in terms of planning for the future of our children.
>> MIRANDA: And your nephew is 14 and your son is 19, right?
So you're covering the gamut for teens.
And Brian has a 20-year-old.
So these are folks who are a little bit younger but also emerging into adulthood and putting them up with an ABLE account for success.
I do want to mention to folks, too.
Cheryl has been giving a lot of presentations this month on ABLE and sharing some resources from the ABLE National Resource Center with other families.
Can you just -- before we move on -- share one or two of those resources that you have highlighted for folks that you've found beneficial?
>> CHERYL: Well, I love the ABLE National Resource Center website.
I love the state comparison tool.
And that was one of the things that when I first found the website back in 2016, '17, it allowed me to be able to compare the different state plans.
And at that time, not a lot of plans were open.
And it allowed me to see which plan offered in terms of maybe the amount to open an account.
You know, what benefits or fees they had, that sort of thing.
That is one of the best tools I think on the website.
But they have many others like the decision guide that helps you to figure out where do you fall in the whole ABLE world and what tools may help you to set up your account.
Or just walk you along the steps, the road map to enrollment.
That's even -- that's something I love also because it just helps people understand where they're going.
And more recently, the podcast that we have on there, even funny enough, this morning I was listening to a few of them, just 30 minutes.
And I had it on while I was making my breakfast and the laptop was just on the dinner table.
And I was just listening to what the people in the podcast were saying about their experience.
And I was hearing things that I could learn or share with others.
So those are some of the things that I think are available on our website that are very, you know, helpful.
>> MIRANDA: Well, and it's great, Cheryl, too that you mentioned you dived in early to ABLE accounts.
And you're still learning new things.
And I think that's important for folks not feel like they have a PhD before moving forward.
You can move forward and learn as you go.
>> CHERYL: Exactly.
Exactly.
Even now because there's more information in terms of how you work with -- if you're getting benefits  with a Social Security income or other types of things.
The special needs trust.
As I'm going along, I'm learning more things and figuring out.
Because like Miranda said earlier, my children are still slightly young.
But my son is, you know, he just started college last week.
This is his second week in college.
So hopefully as he grows and he starts to get into the work world, I need to balance that whole SSI thing.
Or I'm even thinking about doing a special needs trust.
In the beginning, I didn't have that option to do that.
Now I have an option where I might do that.
So I'm learning things about how to combine the ABLE account with your employment income or with your other types of savings tools to make your loved one's life better, help them achieve a better life experience.
And so I'm learning.
>> MIRANDA: Well, and we all are.
And that's great!
We're here together.
That's why we hold this space so we can learn together and share what we're learning and continue to move forward.
You know, you mentioned two things.
I do want to mention the special needs trust piece along with our pooled trust blog that went out on Tuesday.
We shared our ABLE special needs trust and pool trust comparison chart that we have on our website.
And we developed that and work on updating that yearly with the special needs alliance so the information and all of those columns is accurate.
It's a great tool and resource, if you're thinking what's the difference between these protected savings mechanisms and how might they work together too?
So we're continuing to build that out as well.
And for employment that you talked about, you know, last week we were talking with working age account owners.
And so we have some great information there.
We're also going to be in October doing an ABLE to Work month where we're focusing on National Disability Awareness Month in October.
So we're going to be talking about how ABLE can support that as well.
And we can get feedback on what is needed by family members, account owners themselves.
So we're trying to tailor what we're developing towards that.
So thank you, Cheryl.
I'm going to go ahead and unmute -- if I can get Katie's help -- unmute Davinna's line and see if we can bring her in.
We won't have video of Davinna.
But hopefully we'll have audio.
Davinna, are you there?
>> DAVINNA: Hi.
Can you hear me?
>> MIRANDA: First, are you okay?
I'll do a safety check first.
>> DAVINNA: Yes, we are fine.
We have power but we don't have WiFi.
And my phone came back on.
So I was able to call in.
>> MIRANDA: Thank you for persevering and being with us here today, Davinna.
I shared a picture on the intro slides, one of my favorite of you and Shawn.
But tell us a little bit.
You're in Michigan.
And Deshawn is 22 now?
That's right?
>> DAVINNA: Yes.
Deshawn is 22.
I opened Deshawn's ABLE account I believe in 2016.
December, I want to say 2017, in Michigan.
So it's an ABLE account.
Deshawn, I never thought I would need an ABLE account with him.
Deshawn was born with sickle cell disease.
Our life was quote, unquote, normal.
Everybody's normal is different.
He suffered strokes since 11 which left him in a wheelchair and nonverbal.
So our life situation changed dramatically.
We went from him going to school and me going to work everyday to him being in the hospital three months.
I'm taking a leave of absence from work.
I was able to start an ABLE account with just I believe $25 is when I started to open it.
And the reason I opened it is because after our life-changing event, I realized that he was going to have to depend on Social Security income.
And with Social Security income, as we all know, you can only have so much money to do anything with.
And at the time I was activating his account, my concern was if something ever happens to me, how would he survive?
How would the next family member that takes care of him, how would they be able to take care of him and still run their family dynamic?
With him needing and requiring so much.
So that was my main concern when I opened his ABLE account.
And as I say all the time, ABLE has solved five of my six biggest problems.
>> MIRANDA: And I wonder, Davinna too -- before we dive into some questions.
And I want to introduce Joann as well.
But when I think of your story -- you've been with us since 2019 as an ambassador and you had your account two years before that.
Can you share with folks some of the milestones you've been able to achieve already with Deshawn's ABLE account and what your plans for the future are for your ABLE account?
You talked a little bit about the future.
But in particular, an accessible vehicle or other equipment you may need?
>> DAVINNA: Like I said, once Deshawn had strokes, his everything changed.
Our whole world changed.
When I realized he was going to be confined to a wheelchair, that was a big, big issue because at the time I drove a Chevy Suburban.
And anyone who drives a big SUV, there's no way you can get a person with a wheelchair in that SUV.
But I loved my truck.
And I couldn't just get rid of it to get a wheelchair accessible vehicle.
So once I started looking around, I realized how expensive they were.
And that it was going to take some time to get one.
So initially I opened Deshawn's ABLE account as a savings account.
For the future, if something happens to me, he'll have funding.
But the more I learned about ABLE, I learned all the different uses for it.
So it initially started off as a savings for the future.
It has since become -- it has helped purchase his wheelchair accessible vehicle which he got for his 21st birthday.
Deshawn is nonverbal but he can use accessible communication device to communicate.
So his ABLE account has been able to purchase that and the accessories it requires because we couldn't get insurance to cover that.
And then he has issues with swallowing and chewing.
So I have been able to use his ABLE account to purchase those type of accessories as well that he needs that I would normally have to purchase.
So the reason of our ABLE account has changed dramatically over the years that we've had it.
And now essentially it's back to a savings account.
Until we run up into something else that he needs and insurance needs us to pay for.
>> MIRANDA: I think you demonstrate beautifully you and Cheryl and Brian talking before the fact that, you know, it's evolving.
And you meet the needs.
And then you start saving up for the next need.
Is it long term?
Is it short-term things needed with the flexibility there?
Another best practice, Davinna, you learned from another ambassador about gifts into an ABLE account.
Can you talk about that for a minute before we go into introducing Joanne?
>> DAVINNA: So Deshawn graduated from high school in 2019.
And I learned from another ambassador that you can have family and friends donate to your ABLE account.
So I was able to make his graduation announcement and add his ABLE account information to it.
And in lieu of gifts, I asked family and friends to donate to his ABLE account.
Which was very, very successful.
>> MIRANDA: I think Brian, I had sent you some links to Cheryl and Davinna's spotlights on our website.
Maybe you could share those in the chat with folks?
When you go on Davinna's page, you will see a graduation announcement for Deshawn.
And it includes -- we may have had to blur it out.
But it has a reference to ABLE accounts in the link that folks can then click on.
And that was something that Davinna -- one of our 2019 ambassadors -- learned from one of our 2018 ambassadors.
And Brian and Cheryl everyone else who has young people -- or even if you're older and you have a goal, you can let people know about that.
And it's not problematics like a GoFundMe may potentially be.
Thank you so much, Davinna, for weighing in on that.
And now I'll actually go to Joanne Marcus!
Who we're very happy that Joanne is here with us today.
I'll put a spotlight on you, Joanne and bring you on the panel.
Hello.
Thank you to Commonwealth Community Trust for sharing a blog earlier this week.
Hope folks have checked it out talking about Christine -- well, I'll let you talk about Christine and also your experience running a major pool trust and how you're working to include and share information on how ABLE accounts can also -- you don't have to have either/or.
You may want to have one versus the other.
But certainly you also can have both.
>> JOANNE: Absolutely.
And thank you for this opportunity.
I'm excited to be here and to talk about ABLE because I promote ABLE a lot.
Both internally as a pooled special needs trust administrator.
We sign our clients up for ABLE particularly around issues of shelter.
So our clients who get SSI with a pooled special needs trust or a special needs trust, it could jeopardize their SSI supplemental Social Security income benefits.
And we don't want that to happen.
So we're very fortunate to be able to -- you know, when it works and the client is -- has been disabled under the age of 26 and, you know, meets that criteria, we can have that client open up an ABLE account and deposit funds monthly to pay for their shelter expenses.
There's some rules around how we do that and not jeopardize their SSI benefits.
But we know the rules.
And we follow them.
And it works beautifully.
And that's what happened with Christine.
So I'm not sure everyone knows about pooled special needs trusts.
So I thought I'd take a minute to share what, you know, who we are, what we do.
And maybe some of the differences between a pooled special needs trust and an ABLE account, just touching on that a little bit.
But as a pooled special needs trust, we offer the opportunity similar to ABLE to accept funds into a special needs trust for the benefit of the beneficiary and disperse those funds in much the same way that I heard the parents talk about how they use the ABLE account and how grateful they were for this opportunity.
A pooled special needs trust works much the same way.
We have third party trusts set up by family members -- typically not funded until the death of the grantor, the parent, the grandparent, and also first party when there is unfortunately personal injury award or worker's comp award.
And very often these sums of money are larger than $15,000, which is the limit that people can deposit funds into ABLE annually.
And so that's when pooled special needs trusts can be a consideration, I think.
And as a non-profit organization, we also accept the smaller accounts -- really small accounts.
And we're happy to do it because the funds are maintained separately in sub-accounts but pooled for investment purposes.
So that's what a pooled special needs trust is.
So with CCT, the pool now is close to $90 million.
And so to me, it's like a big mutual fund.
And I think, you know, that's nice, again, for those folks that, you know, have the larger settlements that would be appropriate for ABLE.
But when there are smaller settlements and qualify, I love ABLE.
I think it really meets a need.
Just another -- some nuances for the differences that I think are important for families to think about in their planning.
ABLE is, again, a terrific option and I totally support it.
There are some limits.
And I would just talk about when the account goes above $100,000.
Then the individual might lose their -- temporarily until the account goes down -- their SSI benefits.
But for folks that have, you know, funds above $100,000 or anticipate wanting to leave funds in those larger amounts, that's when a pooled special needs trust can be definitely an advantage.
And then the other thing is for the third party trust -- not the first party but the third party, when the family member sets it up.
For an ABLE account in most states, there's a Medicaid payback whereas particularly with CCT, the pooled trust that I'm the executive for, we don't retain any of the remainder.
Some pooled trusts do.
But we do not.
And so whatever funds are remaining upon the death of the beneficiary will go to whomever is named as the recipient.
So the grantor names who would get the remainder.
And so it's not -- for the third party trust, it's not a Medicaid payback trust.
First party, it is.
So anyway.
Just kind of wanted to share in the broader context the differences -- pluses and minuses of ABLE and a pooled special needs trust.
And I'm delighted to be here.
>> MIRANDA: We're glad you're here, Joanne.
And they're all protected.
And there's different times and places where you use those accounted.
With ABLE accounts, it's a smaller amount of money that you're looking to put in.
You can put a lot more money into a special needs trust or a pooled trust.
But then there's a debit account that can be used.
The account owner being able to access those funds, a sense of agency.
If they need some additional support with using those funds that may be in a pooled trust or special needs trust -- and many people might -- then that would be a benefit.
You don't have to do both.
You can do this one, that one, the other one it really depends on your circumstance.
And Brian, if you could put in the link the link to our pooled trust and special needs trust comparison chat.
We have other blogs on our website too.
If this is an area of interest to you or you have more questions on this, check it out.
We have information from Joanne, the Special Needs Alliance.
Because we want people informed.
So with that, I'm actually going to take us over to Laurie to see what kinds of questions are coming in.
And thank you to Davinna and Cheryl and Joanne for introducing yourselves.
And I'm hoping we may have answered a few of these questions just with the introduction and presentation there.
But Joanne, thank you.
We may be coming back to you the next half hour.
But Laurie, I'll pull you in and see what questions are rolling in that you're answering.
I know you and Brian are working hard answering a lot of those questions coming in.
If you have some that are like ten of this question and you want to share this in the group.
>> LAURIE: We'll have this question of Joanne.
Is a pooled special needs trust subject to the same income tax thresholds as a regular third party special needs trust?
And then are pooled special needs trusts taxable as well?
>> JOANNE: From the grantor's perspective who is funding the trust, there's no tax advantage to fund the trust.
Once the trust is funded and it's for the benefit of the beneficiary, then the funds -- the beneficiary will get a K1 for funds that are then dispersed from the trust.
So at that point, the trust is being used.
And so Uncle Sam is due their -- but so many of our beneficiaries really don't pay taxes because their income is so low.
So it's pretty typical that it's a moot issue.
But we always advise people to take their form to a tax preparer and, you know, make sure that nothing is owed.
>> MIRANDA: Great.
Thank you, Joanne.
Laurie, do we have any other questions for other ambassadors or that you could answer that are coming in?
Where people have, hey, this is my question related to the topic of the week?
>> LAURIE: Sure.
So people are asking if their earnings are directly deposited into the ABLE account, is that still countable earned income for SSI and/or SSDI and other means tested programs?
Yes, that continues to be countable, earned income.
By using the Social Security Administration either SSI and/or SSDI work supports, a person may be able to reduce the amount of their countable earned income.
And to learn about that, people want to go to choosework -- all one word.
Choosework.ssa.gov.
And so individuals who work and do not participate in a retirement plan that calender year can save additional earnings from their earnings in their ABLE account.
So there's that $15,000 limit from all sources if that person is working too.
And in the U.S. continental states, they can contribute an additional $12,760 from their earnings.
And it's more for residents of Alaska or Hawaii.
>> MIRANDA: Because the cost of living is higher there.
>> LAURIE: Yes.
And we had a couple people asking --
>> MIRANDA: Yeah.
Could I pause you just for a quick second, too, Laurie.
Not only the choose work website.
But we also have a decision guide on ABLE accounts for working-age folks that's related to employment.
And that's one of our decision guides that's available on our website.
On the menu bar under "resources," if you go to "decision guide," it'll bring up the five decision guides we currently have.
We're in the process of developing three more.
Which would include ABLE accounts, special needs trust, and pooled trusts and the decision guide for that.
You'll have the side-by-side comparison guide.
But I wanted to mention those decision guides as another resource.
We get a lot of feedback on that which will link you to the choose work site if that's the point you're getting to, Laurie.
But I'll hand it back over to you, Laurie.
What are the other questions?
>> LAURIE: So people are wondering, can they development their SSI and/or SSDI directly into the ABLE account?
Yes.
But best case scenario -- best practice -- is for those who receive SSI, to use their SSI to pay for housing and food expenses directly and then extra money can be deposited into ABLE because Social Security Administration is always looking to see that that SSI is being used specifically for that purpose.
And we had one person write in their child newly is a recipient of their SSI.
And they only received two-thirds of SSI because they have not been paying for their housing expenses.
So, you know, that person can be charged rent for where they are living.
And then they will receive additional SSI that will increase by usually one-third for the housing expenses that they are paying.
>> MIRANDA: I'd like to ask Brian.
The email that I had sent you earlier, if you could share the link to Amy Tesler's web page.
And we also have a podcast we did last year on ABLE accounts and special needs trusts where we talk about this specific issue.
Amy Tesler is one of our ambassadors.
And she is a son in his 20s who is working.
And they have this situation with housing.
And it's broken down really beautifully in the highlight.
If you want to read an individual story that explains exactly what Laurie is talking about or listen to the podcast that Amy and Steve Dale, who is a special needs attorney, did with us last year.
So Brian, if you could copy and paste that link into the chat for folks to check it out.
>> BRIAN:  I'll let you know, Miranda, that all of those links are already in the chat.
I could do that one individually.
>> MIRANDA: Yeah.
Amy Tesler, that's the one that would be --
>> BRIAN:  Yes.
I'll also get to the link to the podcast.
>> MIRANDA: And I wonder -- not to make you do too many things at once there, Brian, but Brian has also been manning the Q&A's coming in.
And just with his background as a disability employment -- like nationally renowned, he worked with the U.S. Department of Labors Disability Employment Initiative right up until starting working with us.
This intersection of, you know, you're a parent.
You've got a 20-year-old.
And by the way, people can be 30, 40, or 50.
They just have to have recorded their disability before 26.
We want to emphasize that!
We're talking about a 24-year-old and 19-year-old, 22-year-old.
These examples of folks that we're talking about.
But certainly you can be older than that, too.
But I'm wondering if you wanted to weigh in on where your son might be at with this and the support you're providing around ABLE and employment for this transition age.
>> BRIAN:  Oh, no, absolutely.
It's proving to be kind of a useful tool in the kit around transition.
So my son is 20 years old.
And he's currently attending college.
And he seriously is thinking about working and moving into his own apartment with supports for the first time.
And I have to say, you know, we've worked hard to put a team around him, you know, that include medical, mental health, housing, all sorts of folks.
And it's been kind of interesting and fun and effective to be able to have that ABLE account there as a resource because there's so many different ways that you can use an ABLE account in that kind of a scenario.
You can start putting funds away for specific needs.
I mean, that's one of the things.
I mean, he's thinking about employment now.
But we haven't landed on a firm employment goal.
So it would be hard to predict exactly the supports he's going to need.
Many of those supports -- perhaps vocational rehabilitation will be with me.
Maybe the school will check in and help us out.
Maybe a future employer may be able to contribute.
But with the flexibility that's available around the money in that ABLE account, we're confident that if any loose ends come up -- or I know we were talking earlier about modifications to a car or something.
Or if something like that comes up, funds from that ABLE account can be accessed immediately and as needed for those qualified disability expenses.
So it's cool.
It's a new tool that our team is applying.
>> MIRANDA: So just curious.
Just thinking back to a 20-year-old wanting to be in control of their own funds, too.
>> BRIAN:  Oh, no, that was huge, too!
>> MIRANDA: Talk about this piece.
Because it's very specific and unique to the ABLE account experience because so often there are other beneficial protective savings tools that serve a need, that is real.
But with an ABLE account, for someone who is wanting to build up some financial, you know, capacity to have some autonomy and agency over making financial decisions, whether that's at a small management level or making bigger decisions, supporting that.
>> BRIAN:  I can give you that in the context of a transition thing, which is when we were first looking into, you know, my son getting a service animal, you know, we already had a number of pets.
You'll laugh because you know this.
One of our conditions was he would need to be the one who took charge of that.
And he would need to be the one who paid for that and how to get the dog certified, trained.
And he has done that.
And it's been very, very successful.
And a big part of that was him using his ABLE account funds to pay directly under his control the dog trainer.
He goes online and he goes to the Chewy website and gets the dog supplies and medicines there and has them delivered.
So that was really the first thing in his life that he ran.
You know?
That ABLE account was really a part of that.
And it made it possible.
>> MIRANDA: And not having to ask you or Mom to do that for him, take care of it for him.
>> BRIAN:  Manage it for him.
>> MIRANDA: This is my money and I can use it in this way.
>> BRIAN:  Yes.
And I guess the point I'm making is we incorporate it into a larger transition strategy.
And that's kind of what is so amazing about the ABLE account.
And it's almost like, you know, almost like another provider at the table sometimes.
So I start to get going.
>> MIRANDA: I know, Brian.
We can all get going.
I want to circle back to anything, Cheryl, you may want to add.
You have been seeing the questions coming in.
And from your perspective.
You have a 14 and 19-year-old heading off to college.
A little bit of a different experience than Brian but also similarities.
What would you go back and tell 4 years ago Cheryl what you should do with your ABLE account now that you didn't know then?
That maybe other folks who are on this meeting might benefit from, especially considering the questions that are coming in?
>> CHERYL: Well, I think I sort of said this earlier just in terms of looking at the possibilities of combining the different tools out there like the special needs trust and the ABLE account to make things manageable or plan for the future.
I've said this many times as I've talked to families.
Having the ABLE account gave me piece of mind because I was very terrified in the early stages of my son's diagnosis about 20 years ago because people kept talking about this spending money down thing.
And and when a baby is born in a family, grandma or grandpa or your aunt or somebody goes out and buys a savings bond for a child.
Or even as a parent.
I have an older son.
I opened a saving account for him.
And when I realized where Shawn was.
And I felt -- honestly, I felt guilty that I couldn't open a savings account for him and sort of build the same kind of financial vision that I had for my other son.
And so the ABLE account --
>> MIRANDA: And Cheryl has three sons, by the way.
>> CHERYL: And my oldest is quote, unquote, a typical young 20-year-old living his life and doing his thing.
But even recently, he got a full-time job and he was doing his benefits planning and he was able to open his own 401(k).  And I feel like my other boys, now that they have an ABLE account, they have a similar vehicle that's going to help them with their future.
And peace of mind, joy just as a parent knowing I'm able to do that for them and give them that platform to stand on.
It's a joy for me.
It's peace of mind and a joy.
So I saw a question I parent posted.
And I believe Laurie answered it.
And Brian was just talking about being able to -- his son using the ABLE account funds to make a purchase online.
The debit card feature, even though we are not currently using my son's -- both our younger sons' account for actual purchases because we're kind of using them as saving vehicles.
But the debit card feature was important to me when I opened the account.
And when we first opened the first account, it wasn't a part of the plan at the time.
But they rolled it in after the plan was opened.
And so they sent it.
It has my son's name on, not my name.
It's not my account for him.
It's his account.
And now that he is in college, you know, I'm thinking of kind of giving him that option to use the card, with some parameters about how he can spend the money.
Because I don't want him to go out and buy Skittles with it.
So I'll have to educate him on the things he can purchase with it.
But we all make mistakes.
And we all have to learn.
And we all have to take steps through those transition processes.
And so, you know, that's what I think for me the peace of mind and just the opportunity to give him that platform to grow.
>> MIRANDA: Thank you for sharing that, Cheryl.
And answering some of the questions while you did.
And sharing more about your situation.
I'm going to take us back over to Davinna, too.
As we're wrapping up with Cheryl, I want to mention that Cheryl works with Head Start, a nonprofit that oversees the programs in North Carolina.
They've been adopting the tool kit and plan ahead tool kits for Head-start counselors for ABLE accounts.
This is one of the reasons she's one of our ambassadors, getting that information out there as well.
We put you to a lot of work, Cheryl.
As we do, Davinna!
And I'm going to go back to Davinna.
If you could unmute your line if you're still with us, Davinna.
And Davinna earlier this year started a non-profit to support other parent who is are caregivers.
And as part of that, Davinna, you've been sharing information about ABLE accounts.
And we only have a few minutes left.
I need to cover a few slides at the end.
But just in two minutes or so, Davinna, could you just share why you're sharing information about ABLE accounts  with other parents who are in a care giving support position as you are with Deshawn to just address the five out of six issues you say you really needed in an ABLE account to address in your lives?
>> DAVINNA: Actually, the answer has already been given.
And that is, it gives you as a parent or caregiver peace of mind.
So you don't have to stress about what's going to happen if I have a sudden expense or what's going to happen if I need a large sum of money that can't be saved because of SSI rules.
So the peace of mind that you get from having the ABLE account is worth it.
It's worth doing the research and the homework.
And the ABLE NRC website actually walks you step by step through the process.
So you don't even have to really do homework.
You just have to read a little and understand a little and read a little more.
And you'll get it.
>> MIRANDA: Thank you so much, Davinna.
And Cheryl and Joanne, Brian, Laurie.
I'm going to go ahead and I'm going to stop sharing.
Oh, I think this worked.
Wait.
Hang on a second.
I want to go back to sharing the PowerPoint as we're wrapping up here.
Aha!
I think I found it.
There we go.
Just thank you everyone!
We only have a couple minutes left.
And so I want to just go through -- well, actually before I do, Laurie, do you have any last comments that you wanted to share based on the discussion that we had that you feel would be a good final point to end on before I go to our final slides?
>> LAURIE: So I think the most important thing to remember is over time, you will learn more about the ABLE account.
There's a lot of information posted at our website.
Each ABLE plan has a disclosure document that provides additional details.
It's important to read that.
So for example, when a person makes a deposit into the ABLE account, they know how long it is before their funds is available to spend on qualified disability expenses.
And the ABLE accounts have really inspired families to come together to help that individual who has a disability, learn skills in managing their own money, saving more, and investing within the ABLE account to, you know, reach short-term goals and long-term goals in the future.
And a part of that is, you know, many families have established a pool or a special needs trust.
You can include that administrator authorization to deposit funds up to $15,000 directly into that ABLE account each calender year so the funds can be used to meet that person's needs.
>> MIRANDA: And I think, too, one of our decision guides that went out this week -- and if it didn't, check out our decision guides -- how to find funds to put into an ABLE account.
That's going to be a keen interest of you if you're helping a family member or someone who you're working with to open an ABLE account and make the most of it.
There's a wealth of information.
We're always building new tools and resources.
And we use our ambassadors who are ABLE account owners, family members, who have been in this space.
They come with us and figure out what would be helpful to all of you in our audience.
Well, thank you!
We just have two minutes left.
And I just want to share really quickly.
Hope you are following our 2021 ABLE to Save campaign.
You can follow us on Facebook or Twitter.
We only have two days left, Monday and Tuesday.
We hope you'll join us on our final panel on Monday and check out all the great information on our 2021 ABLE to Save web page.
And stay tuned for new events that will be coming in for future months.
And do, please, help spread the word.
You are joining some of the first 100,000 folks who entered this space of entering an ABLE account.
We got about, you know, the space is really growing.
There's currently about 8 million people eligible.
So there's so many more folks that could save from this.
So we hope you join our newsletter and follow us up on our future webinars.
And we want to end by saying a big thank you to our ABLE to high pressure save sponsors this week, once again, ABLE now and ABLE America.
Thank you for our ambassadors, Joanne Marcus, my team members Laurie and Brian, and thank you to all of you for being here with us.
Connect with us again.
You can always e-mail us at info@ablenrc.org.
Or just check out our website.
It's highly searchable.
So you can plug in any keywords you may have into the search bar in the upper right-hand side.
If you can't find it in the toolbar or home page.
So with that, thank you, everyone.
And have a great day!
We hope we'll see you early next week joining us again.
Bye, everyone!