Date:  11/18/21 
Event:  SignNexus 

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>> Miranda: Thank you for joining us.  We're going to be getting started here momentarily, a little bit after of the start of the hour.  But we see lots of folks are rolling in and we're looking forward to our webinar today and you joining us.  So thank you, and hold tight.  We'll be getting started in about just another minute or two.  And welcome, everyone, to our able National Resource Center's November webinar where we're doing a spotlight on ABLE collaboration.  We're very glad all of you can join us today.  We'd like to thank our funder, Prudential, for funding the grant for the ABLE National Resource Center.  We will be together today starting right now, we've got the next 75 minutes for our presentation, our featured presentation.
Before we get started, though, let's just touch base on a couple quick logistics for listening to the webinar to make sure everyone has a great experience.  We want to let you know that the audio for today's meeting can be accessed using computer audio or by calling in by phone.  If you select computer audio, please make sure your speakers are turned on or our headphones are plugged in.  If you do not have sound capabilities or prefer to listen on your phone, dial 1‑(292)920‑5609.  The webinar ID is 84122560624.  We also have realtime captioning for today.  The captions can be found by clicking on the closed captions icon in your Zoom controls at the bottom of the screen.  If you do not see the captions after clicking the button, please alert the host and you can do that using the chat box.  However, that is the only place we want you to be using the chat today.  In terms of submitting questions, we have our team of subject matter experts at the ABLE National Resource Center available to answer questions, but we ask that you use the Q&A box to submit those questions.  That will provide a much more effective way to respond to your individual questions and track that.  So please make sure you know where that Q&A box is and use that to submit any of your questions.  We also ask that you explore our able National Resource Center website for answers to all of your questions and for additional information within our archived webinar's, resources, and nut letters at ablenrc.org.  We also have a few slides at the ends with some great links to resources that I know the people will probably be referencing in the Q&A.  For any technical assistance, if you're experiencing any of those technical difficulties, you can let us know by e‑mailing intro@ablenrc.org with the subject headline webinar help and someone will get back to you pretty quick.  Please also do note this webinar is being recorded and the materials will be placed on the ABLE National Resource Center website, along with all of our other ABLE webinars.
My name Miranda Kennedy.  I'm the Director of the ABLE National Resource Center, and I'm happy to be your facilitator here today.  And I just have a few items to get through here on our agenda before we hand it over to our presenter.  I'm going to be just quickly sharing information about the ABLE National Resource Center, as well as what we do with our ABLE program spotlights, and then we'll be hand it go over to David Bell to present on the ABLE collaboration, talking about their mission and partnerships, accessibility, their features, as well as policy discussion.  Then we can go to questions and answers and show those ABLE NRC resources.
So for those of you who maybe it's your first time joining us, if not, a quickly fresher.  The ABLE National Resource Center is the leading comprehensive source of objective independent information about federal and state related ABLE programs and activities, and that includes guidance on tax‑advantaged ABLE savings accounts and best practices as well.  So it really is our mission and our privilege to be here to educate and promote and support the positive impact that ABLE can make on the lives of what we estimate to be currently 8 million eligible Americans with disabilities and their families.  We've done a lot of pioneering work in this area and we've got great subject matter expertise on our team, and this does make us the foremost authority on topics related to achieving the better life experience, or ABLE act, ABLE account, state ABLE programs, annually able‑related policy developments, and the comprehensive integration of ABLE and financial capability strategies for people with disabilities into public service delivery systems.  Our website, that comprehensive website, which is a wonderful clearinghouse of information, can be found at ablenrc.org.
So just bringing some awareness to what we're doing on our spotlight series which we're doing here today, we do conduct a series of ABLE program spotlight webinars.  This really is intended for those who already have a basic understanding of ABLE.  We have many webinars and materials that can lay the foundation for basic understanding of ABLE.  Our hope is you've accessed some of that and have some baseline of information.  Some will be covered here, but this really is meant to be a deeper dive where state ABLE programs, which are part of multi‑state collaborations, as well as individual state programs that may be within the state or open nationally, have an opportunity to provide program‑specific details, do a little bit of a deeper dive on what their specific program looks like, the features, and what they have to offer, as well as some general guidance and best practices for those programs.  These spotlights, you know, they cover concepts related to investing and saving, a topic that many people with disabilities might be very new to, especially those folks who are on [Indiscernible] tested benefits and haven't had the opportunity to save and invest before above that $2,000 resource limit, asset limit.
And really, we want to offer the programs an opportunity to talk more about that and share that information with you for folks who want to make the most of their able account, have a better understanding of what those options look like, or maybe moving into opening one for the first time.  We do have, there's a link there to our ABLE program spotlight activities.  That's also available on our website under resources on the tool bar.  You click on webinars and it will bring up all of our previous spotlight programs, as well as our other webinars.
With that, I've taken up plenty of our time.  Let me quickly introduce you to David Bell.  You're going to be in great hands with David.  David is the Deputy Director of the Oregon Treasury Savings Network, and their network oversees Oregon's savings plans and programs, including the Oregon ABLE savings plan.  Oregon established the ABLE collaboration in 2017.  It's grown a bit since then, as he'll talk about, and really, this is meant to bring together like‑minded states within that collaboration to establish ABLE's savings plans that best serve the people in their state.
So David, I'm just going to hand it over to you to take it away.
>> David:  Thank you, Miranda.  Good morning, good afternoon to everybody.  I really appreciate this opportunity.  I love these spotlights.  I love all of the resources that the national Disability Institute, ABLE, NRC, national reverse center puts out there.  It's a huge benefit to I know us who are trying to offer these savings plans in a way that best suits individuals, but it's also an incredible resource for all of those individuals that may feel like ABLE is a good resource for them.
So thank you for letting me take the time.  I do know there's probably some individuals out there that do have some specific questions about ABLE in general, as Miranda, you said.  We're going to spend a little bit more time focusing today on a little bit of a deeper dive, but happy to save quite a bit of time at the end for any questions that individuals have along the way.  Once again, this is David Bell.  I work for the Oregon state treasury.  And in fact, I joined the Oregon state treasury back in 2015 specifically to help start the Oregon ABLE savings plan.  My role has changed since then, but the ABLE savings plans are absolutely near and dear to my heart.  We launched the Oregon ABLE savings plan at the end of 2016, in 2016 is when most of the first states were launching ABLE savings plans.  And felt like we were in good hands.  Back then, and even now, all of the states that are offering ABLE savings plans talk to each other and share ideas and best practices.  But we saw that there was an opportunity to work even a little bit closer with certain states, and so we started what was called the ABLE collaboration.  But I want to kind of dive into why we did.
From the very beginning, different states came together to partner.  We were talking to some of those other partner states as well to see what would be the best fit, and Oregon was able to launch its ABLE savings plan outside of the partnership, and we decided to do that, but we so valued all of those opportunities to meet with people, share best practices, and when we launched at the end of 2016, we didn't actually have any plans to start anything like ABLE collaboration.  There was already one strong partnership out there, which is still around, and another one that was in the works.  We only decided to start the ABLE collaboration after we heard from a few states that were looking for something just slightly different than some of the other partnership opportunities.
For all of those individuals out there that are just listening to this, to try to understand what the best savings plan for them, well, I would tell you, first, please look at the ABLE savings plan in your state.  There's a very good chances, regardless of who is overseeing that and managing that, that savings plan might be the best for you.  If you really want to see what the best savings plan is and maybe you don't have a savings plan in your state or you just want to look around a little bit more, definitely look at the resources that are at the ABLE National Resource Center that national disability institute has put together, some great resources for you.  I'm not here to say that the ABLE collaboration states are any better than any of the others.  I just want to highlight why we feel like we came together and are trying our best to offer strong savings plans for everybody.
So as I mentioned, we decided that we would come together with a few states and be able to offer options for states to be able to start up their ABLE savings plan.  Miranda, would you mind going to the next slide?
So here it is.  Here is the ABLE collaboration.  The Oregon ABLE savings plan, that's the savings plan that I offer here in the state of Oregon with our incredible team.  And that was the one that we started first.  You'll also see a logo on the right‑hand side called ABLE for all.  That's our savings plan as well.  It's just our national savings plan.  Oregon ABLE savings plan are for Oregon residents, and ABLE for all is very similar.  It's just offered to anybody outside of Oregon, and those are the ones that we started with.  As I mentioned before, we soon heard that there was just a few other states.  We're not a large partnership collaboration, as you can see here, but we are growing.  But we heard from some states that we were looking for something just slightly different, and so we soon were joined by Washington State's ABLE savings plan you see there, Maryland's ABLE there as well.  And then just recently we were lucky enough to have Alabama able join our ABLE collaboration and the Hawaii ABLE savings program as well.  And I'm going to spends just a little time introducing them in just a few minutes.  I'd like to first talk about the collaboration in general.
All of these savings plans that you're seeing here manage their own state savings plan.  They are part of the partnership where we share best practices and learnings.  We do work with some of the same kind of templates and ideas and thoughts, but they're their own state savings plans, which was pond to us.  We really wanted them to know and be able to manage their plans, because we know how to best work with individuals in their states.  So that was key to us from starting the ABLE collaboration.  And we're excite to have this group of individuals here, because we work with them on a regular basis.  About 45 minutes ago, I was on the call with most of these states, just talking through some ways that we can continue to make our savings plans even better and we always learn from each other.
Before I go to the next slide and spend a little bit more time talking about Alabama ABLE savings plan and Hawaii ABLE savings program, I want to talk about the fact that there are a few other states that we work closely with as well, because they happen to work with our same main partner, and that's a group called someday.  They're part of the bank of New York melon now.  Another group that works with them is Florida's ABLE savings plan that we are ABLE United.  We're excited we get to work closely with them.  They have a whole bunch of great ideas that we share back and forth.  And also the stable plans.  There's quite a few stable accounts out there, and we work with them closely, because they also utilize someday in the bank of New York Mellon as a program.  All that to say is I think people should feel rest assured that we are all very collaborative in the work that we do together, because at the core, we're okay with a saver choosing a different savings plan.  We just want to make sure they're choosing the right one for them and getting supports that they need.  Miranda, if you don't mind going to the next slide?
So we were really excited to have AlabamaABLE join the ABLE collaboration.  As many people know, Alabama has had an ABLE savings plan.  They did decide to join the ABLE collaboration, and were.  They're led by a dynamic group of individuals there in the Alabama state treasurer's office.  Daria Story is the assistant state treasurer and very engaged and active with this program, and so is Anita Kelley, the Director of the savings division those two individuals are so passionate, so dedicated, and so ready to help anybody that is not only saving in their ABLE savings program, but any.  And so we are really excited that they joined us.  They joined the ABLE collaboration and initially launched the AlabamaABLE plan in May of 2021.  I would suggest if people have not done so already, go to AlabamaABLE.gov and learn more about that savings plan.  I think you'll be excited.  Thank you, Miranda.
We're super excited for our newest partner in the ABLE collaboration, and this is the state of Hawaii.  So the Hawai'iABLE Savings Program was launched in November of 2021.  We did a soft launch before that.  We launched on November 1.  I am absolutely jealous of their logo, I think it is the left logo of all ABLE savings plans.  I'm sorry to any ABLE savings plans out there listening, but this thing is beautiful.  I love it, but also, it's a testament to the state itself and all of the islands and also to the individuals that are behind the efforts there.
So as you can see, the Hawai'iABLE Savings Program is very lucky to have some very strong state agencies.  You think see the Hawaii Department of budget and finance, Mark Anderson is the administrator and has been involved in this effort for a lodge time.  Passionate and knowledgeable to offer great plans to affects programs.  You also see Daintry Bartoldus, Executive Director.  I have been a fan of Daintry long before I got to work with her in the ABLE space, because she is well‑known, at least in the Pacific Northwest, if not beyond, for her incredible work in supporting people with disabilities.  So we are excited not only to have those two individuals, but to have them part of the state agencies that can so seamlessly share information about Hawai'iABLE Savings Program and the need for and the benefits of savings programs like ABLE there in that state.  So again, if you haven't done so, I would really suggest you go to Hawai'iABLE savings.com.  I think you'll find their website chockful of great information and chockful of great imagery.  I wish we had as many gorgeous images as Hawaii does.  So we're excited to welcome Alabama and Hawaii to the collaboration, along with Maryland and Washington State.  Super excited.
Miranda, if we can go to the next slide.  Part of this presentation today was for me just to introduce the States that are part of the ABLE collaboration, but with so many people listening in, I think it's important for us to talk a little bit about what the ABLE collaboration offers, but I really want to make sure that this is relevant for everybody out there.  Again, I am not suggesting that any of the ABLE collaboration states is the right ABLE plan for you.  I really think you should look closely at the state you live to see what ABLE program is available there if you want.  You can still look deeper than that.  Of course that is your right.  And if so, please use the ABLE NRC's website and resources.  We're going to share links to those at the end of this presentation to really dive into which ABLE plan might be best for you.
But in doing so, I'd like to also just talk about some of the things that we offer here, because I feel like it's not fully unique to us.  I feel like we do a good job of this, because we really brought some really strong people together.  I think other savings plans do a good job with this as well.  So this is going to be relevant for anybody listening in and participating today, whether you have an ABLE savings plan with one of our collaboration states or if you don't or if you're just trying to find more information about how this might be a good resource for you or for a loved one.
So as you can see here, our mission is really just to support individuals who can utilize ABLE plans, individuals who are experiencing disabilities in our states and outside our states.  ABLE with his a vital tool that was added to our toolbox back in 2015 so that we can help people who experience this be able to save money without that money counting against the resource limits for those benefits that they deserve and they absolutely need of it was a solution a long time coming.  We're happy to be a small piece of the solution here.  We really try to focus our mission through key partnerships, which I'll talk about here in just a moment, through accessibility overall for the program in the way that's utilized.  For key features that we've baked into all of these savings plans to make them better and into policy to open up opportunity for more and more individuals.
Mile an hour ran an, could we go to the next slide?  Is let's just talk about partnerships really quickly here.  I cannot think of a savings plan or even a program overall where partnerships has been more important.  And this is not just for ABLE collaboration states, although we took this very seriously.  It was the core of our development of these ABLE savings plans, and here's why.  When I started with the Oregon state treasury, I soon saw we had all of the capabilities and resources and ability to create a savings plan.  We did it before, we did it for the college savings plans.  We had other types of savings opportunities.  But what I quickly realized is that we needed key insights from individuals who are part of the disability community, that support the disability community in so many ways, and so we immediately established a strong working group of partners to help make sure we got this thing right.  We can help set up the saving mechanisms, how that works, but we need to know what features do you need?  How can we best word this and make it sound correct somewhats a the right compliance here for ADA compliance and others?  We really want to make sure that we're not missing things.  And so we're continuously trying to do better and be better.  The reason why we're doing is the partnerships on the screen.
This is just a snapshot.  This is so many more.  There are other states outside of the collaboration partner tirelessly with organizations just like this.  For those of you looking at the screen, you're seeing some of these organizations are national organizations.  Some of them are stated specific organizations.  You're seeing ones from Maryland and Washington State and Hawaii and Alabama, of course Oregon as well here.  The reason why we feel like we're offering strong savings plans is because we got insight from all of these individuals here, plus people themselves who experience disabilities to make sure that we are setting these plans up in a way that best serves them.
So we believe partnerships were key then and we know they're key now, maybe even more, to make sure we get this thing right.  Miranda, do you mind going to the next slide?  Thank you, you read my mind.
A key aspect that we're mentioning beyond partnerships is accessibility.  It's really important to understand that ABLE was always supposed to be established for the empowerments of the individual with the disability.  It wasn't supposed to be just another savings plan for some family member to set up for somebody else, although that happens, and we 'em bra he is that and we're happy for that.  But it really is supposed to be an empowerments tool, a savings tool for the person with the disability.  In doing that, we need to make sure it's understandable for all of us, that it is easy to use, and that it has the accessibilities baked in.
I feel like we're doing a good job with this.  I know for certain we can do so much better.  So we really appreciate the feedback we're getting from our savers, from individuals that use our savings plans from the partners that we have and more, but we obviously take ADA standards absolutely seriously, but even more.  And where are we can, we try to make these plans as accessible as possible.  You can look at all of our websites.  Although they're all different, there are key aspects that are similar, and that's due to either lessons learned or accessibility standards.  You'll see, also, in our marketing materials, we do have some marketing materials that are not ADA client, but we try to make the vast majority are, with the colors, with the font size, with the way it's laid out, our forms, presentations, our service center, the individuals that work in our service center go through extra training just to make sure they're capable and ready to work with individuals in all areas of life and in all situations.  So we try to take this really seriously.  Again, we know we can do better.  If you look at our website and our materials, we hope we're on a good path to even get better from there.
Go to the next slide.  Thank you.
You know, another aspect of accessibility, and this is just one, I tried to pull out just a few pieces here, holistically, these ABLE savings plans are working so hard to make sure these are available to individuals all throughout our communities and many more nationally.  One of the things that we did was spearheaded by the stated of Maryland.  They did a fantastic job of coming up with this incredible idea, piloting it, and being able to provide a toolkit for the rest of our states.  And I know other states offer similar things to this so that we are getting more opportunity for individuals to be able to utilize these ABLE savings plans.  When we offered the ABLE savings plans, we soon realized that yes, many people who experience disabilities open up and manage these savings plans all by themselves.  Or they do it with the support of their loved ones, supportive decision‑making or what have you, and we love to see that.  We would move that to be the case as much as possible.
We also know some individuals want or need help managing that ABLE account.  And so federally, we are allowed to have individuals that we call authorized deal representatives.  That's where you see the ALC stands for authorized legal representative.  Those individuals can help manage an ABLE account for somebody else.  And many times, this is a family member, a loved one, maybe somebody who is the representative payee for an individual.  But it is an individual that is serving as authorized legal representative for another person or another individual and that's worked out great from the very beginning.
We did soon realize, though, that there were many organizations, maybe nonprofit organizations or others that are supporting many people with disabilities that need help managing their ABLE plans.  And so what Maryland helped us do and what we have now spread out to all of our ABLE states is we establish what's called the ALR, entity authorized legal representative, so that an organization itself could become that authorized legal representative for all of the people that they support.  And what this does is just open the door for individuals who really need an ABLE plan that didn't have one person help support them.  It gave them the opportunity to be able to have, utilize, and thrive with these ABLE savings plans.  So it was something we realized along the way.  We realized that we were not accessible enough for a subset of individuals and so way built out the entity ALR process exactly for this, so we're really excited to offer this.  If this is somebody that works for an entity or organization that may want more information about this, I would suggest getting in stuff with your state's ABLE savings plan, especially if you're part of the ABLE collaboration.  I know there are some ABLE plans that do not offer entity ALRs.  Some of them do.  Reach out to your state ABLE savings plan and they can provide you a toolkit to make sure this is a good resource for you and help you along the way.
Next slide, please, Miranda.  Okay.  So now we're going to jump into a few slides with just the features.  Again, I think this is still tied to accessibility.  I think it's tied to education.  I think it's tied to just general usability.  But we wanted to make sure that our savings plan worked and made sense for people from all talks of life.  You're going to notice probably the biggest thing that you're going to notice when you open up an ABLE savings plan is the key partner, the key program manager that we call or the main partner that helps oversee the savings plan or run the savings plan.  We call them program managers.  And again, here for the ABLE collaboration, along with the State of Florida and all of the stable programs and employment out there.  We use a group called someday, and they're part of the Bank of New York Mellon.  Many of you know, because you have ABLE plans, but these ABLE plans are basically online banking or savings options.  They're not brick and mortar sites like a building that you would walk into on a corner of your favorite, you know, street.  These are online banking opportunities.  And so we need to make sure that that online interface, the dashboards and the way that people engage and utilize their plans makes sense and works for them.  So you're seeing a small snapshot of part of the opening process of able for all.  This looks similar for all of our able collaboration states.  And we thought it would be really important, because we know that individuals that are savings and able are oftentimes saving for something special, something specific.  We can also save for general things as well, but many times people are saving for something or a multiple set of things.  So we built into, right into the interface itself the ability for somebody to set their own savings goal.  And then they can track their progress towards that savings goal, which is really exciting.  I happen to teach personal finance newspaper a local university here in Oregon, at the Portland State University, and one of the biggest things and the first things we talk to these college students about, about how to manage their money, is the having first thing we talk about is goal setting.  So we wanted to build that right into the features of ABLE savings plan as well, so you can put your goal in there and we can help you track your progress to that goal and celebrate as you get closer.  Miranda, can we go to the next slide?
Another feature that we like to highlight is the fact that first, many individuals that are utilizing ABLE savings plans, this might be the first time that they've ever had the opportunity to save money or the first opportunities to ever invest money.  And so we try to be very careful.  And these are complex issues.  Again, just like I said when I'm teaching at Portland State University with these college students which are in the business classes and such, still, we need to break down the differences between savings and investing.  So while people are opening up their ABLE savings plan, we try to give them a multitude of ways for them to be able to learn more about the different kind of ways that they can save their money, because there are options inside these ABLE savings plans.
And so we start out with just a little bit of information.  You're seeing some here right here.  They can dive into finding out, well, who might save their money in what's called the ABLE conservative or the ABLE moderate or even ABLE aggressive?  And I haven't walked through all of our savings options, but these are a few of them.  And so we try to give them a little bit more information.  If they want more information than this, we let them dive in even deeper.  They can click on buttons to learn more and read more.
Now, many of our ABLE savers, they're well experienced.  They have a whole multitude of information and tools around savings and investing.  Others don't.  So we try to provide as much information as we feel they need to allow them to see in themselves, yeah, I fit best here.  Miranda, could you go one more slide?
This is a chance for them to even click deeper.  There's a big difference between savings and investing of there's been some great webinars that ABLE NRC has put out there and others talking about savings versus investing and many times people who are utilizing ABLE savings plans, this might be the first time they can invest.  This is the first slide that shows a much deeper dive.  When someone is opening up their ABLE savings plan, if they want a little information, they don't have to click on something.  If they want a little more information, you can click on what they saw in the last slide.  If you want really detailed information, this is more information than I might even need.  You can click all the way down to find exactly what individual mutual funds, getting into a lot of detail here, makes out the ABLE moderate.  Some people who save with ABLE want to dive into this much detail, and they can click on each one of these to learn more about the individual funds that are inside of it, so I'm getting really detailed here and I don't mean to be.  What we're really saying is we need to give every saver the right amount of information with them so they can dig deeper if they want or they can stay at the nice higher level that most people stay at.  Miranda, we can go to the next slide, please.
As I mechanic, I went through all of that before I recommended what our savings options were in specific to the Oregon ABLE savings plan, although this is similar to a lot of our other ABLE collaboration partners.  And this is pretty similar to a lot of savings plans out there, although some might have more than these, but this is basically it.  Basically, when somebody is saving in an ABLE savings plan, like a savings option or an investing option, or they can choose a little bit of both.  For us here in Oregon, you can see we do have what's call the cash option.  It's just an FDIC insured, Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation is what FDIC stands for.  It's basically insurance for any money that you're saying.  It's very secure money.  It's like a savings plan or savings account at your local bank.  So if somebody wants their money very secure, they can carry it in the cash option.  If they actually want to invest some of their money, maybe some of the money they don't need right away and they're hoping is going to grow with the markets, they can choose maybe one of the investment options.  As I mentioned before, we have a conservative option.  They have a moderate option and an aggressive option.  I'm not going to go into a lot of detail here today.  That's not actually what we're diving into, but the websites go into a lot of detail.  There's a lot of great resources and webinars out there that cover some of the differences here, and I would suggest you go and look on the ABLE envelop RC website or on one of our websites to learn a little bit more.  Can we go to the next slide?
Another feature that we baked right into our ABLE savings plan here at the ABLE collaboration is a really strong and easy to use dashboard.  Basically, this is where you go to manage your money to maybe put more money in ABLE account, to take money out of your ABLE account, to see if that money is growing or to track your progress for your goals.  Everything that I'm mentioning is right there in front of you in it a very simple and easy manner.  So you can see the activity that you've been doing, how many times you've been taking out money and adding to it.  You can manage your prepaid card, which I haven't talked about yet, but I will in just a second.  Transferred money in and out and so much more.  So we worked really closely with our partners to make sure the features that were part of this dashboard were ones that really worked for people that are managing their ABLE plans.
Miranda, we can go to the next slide, please.  A really exciting feature that we've incorporated here and I know other ABLE plans have as well, but for the ABLE collaboration, we have things called gifting pages.  I always like to say what is one of the best ways to save money for your future?  Well, it's to have other people help you save money for your future.  So of course we want you, as the individual, to be able to save your money in these ABLE savings plans and that's what they were built for, but why not let your family and your loved ones and others help you save for your goals?  And so we have the ability for a family member to send in a check with kind of a slip to gift it to people's an downtowns and that works, people use that.  But the majority of people who want.  It's pretty exciting neck do that, jump into their Account, build out a gifting page for that.  And then be able to send this information out this, page out either via social media or maybe through e‑mail or share it in other ways.  And then it's just a simple way for your family or loved ones to see that you have gifting account.  Maybe it's something I set up for your birthday.  Maybe for your graduation.  Maybe it's just because and they can click on that button and be able to donate to your or to provide money to your able plan.
So again, we heard really early on that families very much wanted to participate in the savings options for their loved ones, and so we work with our program manager to build out this gifting option.  And we love to see it utilized, because we want the whole community to be a part of under the circumstances saving for our future and setting us up for those successes.  Miranda, we can go to the next page.  Thank you.
Another feature of our savings plan that we are really excited about is the ABLE prepaid card.  And we offer our prepaid card through a company called TrueLink.  I am a big fan of TrueLink.  I've known them for quite a while and the great team that they have over there.  When we saw we had the opportunity to work with them by offering their prepaid cards through our program, we jumped all over it.  Let me start all over again.  Let knee go to the basics of this.  We know that ABLE plans need to be a strong and safe place for people to save money, but at the same time, our savings plans need to be a strong place for people to be able to spend their money.  These are transactional accounts.  Here in Oregon, we find that many people use these kind of specifically for savings, and they don't spend a whole bunch.  But when we do need to use their money, we want to make it available to them.  So there's a whole bunch of easy ways that people can put Monday in and take money out of an ABLE accounts.  We wanted to give them an opportunity to have a prepaid card.  For all of those people listening in, you may be familiar with debit cards tied to your bank account of this is similar, but not the same.  You're also familiar with credit cards which basically you're borrowing money when you use that and you pay it back.  Again, this is similar, but it's not the aim.  These are prepaid cards, so TrueLink offers prepaid cards.  They are Visa cards.  I realize our image there is old.  I think is shows a Mastercard, but the TrueLink card is a Visa card.  It can be used anywhere Visa offers their services.  So they can utilize that wherever we want.  So basically, what they can do is if they want to utilize the prepaid card, they order one from us.  Not everybody that saves with us utilizes these, but they can order one with us.  And they can load money from their ABLE account right onto their prepaid card.  This can be a small amount.  $50, $25, $10, or it can be a large amount.  It can be $500, a $1,000, and then this can use that able prepaid card online.  Maybe they're buying something from Amazon or one of their favorite vendors P you can Tuesday in the community or to book travel.  You've heard stories about our young savers feeling really empowered up to able to go out in the community where their friends w their cable card rather than trying to carry around cash, which can be hard to carry and keep sea.  We felt like this was a big feature.  Many able savings plans offered a prepaid card or debit card.  We're excited to have TrueLink, because there's just so many features that you can use the TrueLink card for.
Before I move forward, I do want to touch a little bit on that.  TrueLink is amazing in the capabilities that they paid out.  Many get these prepaid cars just as they are and not have any limits on it.  Some people may choose to put a limit on themselves.  Some people may experience a disability, a restriction on where they can spend money.  Though may want to block themselves from using it at certain stores or other certain items and they can do that.  Maybe a parent of a younger child is maybe just start to go use their ABLE account can put some restrictions on a card for them.  Maybe they can't spend a certain amount over at a store or maybe we don't want them going to a certain store.  I guess what I'm saying here is it's a great resource that either can be left open to use how them or they can success restrictions on it if they choose to do so.  So again, with he see this as a nice feature of the plan.  Miranda, perfect.
So I think it's important to talk about this.  We would love to be able to offer ABLE savings plans at no cost.  I don't think there's any state out there offering an ABLE savings plan that wants to charge fees.  We don't.  Unfortunately, we have to.  We have to offer a savings plan that becomes self‑such end or not so reliant on the states.  And to do this, and of course there are fees we have to do as well to offer these.  We have to have a fee for the saves.  We're really excited at the ABLE collaboration that we offer some of the lowest fees in the nation on our ABLE plans.  We've worked really hard to do this.  In fact, one of the key aspects of the ABLE collaboration is that when we started this partnership opportunity, we negotiated with our key partner, some day, to lower fees for any state that comes in and utilizes the ABLE collaboration.  Before the ABLE collaboration was there, we had to pay higher fees or the saves had to say higher fees for the Oregon ABLE savings plan.  As soon as we established the ABLE collaboration, we established lower fees that benefit us, benefit all of the collaboration states, but more importantly, benefits our saves who use our savings plans.  I think I should just mention really quickly that there is a $35 fee just to have an ABLE savings plan with the collaboration states.  That's just a fee that comes out, a portion of that comes out every quarter.  It comes right out of the account to cover that $35 fee.  It's just $35 per year and a small fee tied to this point, .3 to.36, based on how much is in there.  That's a small fee, depending on how much you have saving this that plan.
We also tried really hard to make the contributes into the plan be as small as possible.  There's times our savers are only put a little money into able.  We worked hard with key partners to lower these.  The very first time somebody opens an ABLE savings plan with the ABLE collaboration, they have to put in at least $25, and that is their first deposit of that's their money that they're putting into the ABLE savings plan.  In I time they put in money after that, it can be as low at $10.  Peck put more in there if they want, of course, but it can be as low as $10 in the plan after that.  So we worked really hard to keep our minimum contribution as low as possible.  This is a key aspect to savings plans, and you can find more information about these or compare them to other states at the ABLE national resource website, which we'll show you at the he.  Miranda, you can go to the next slide.
We are getting really close to the ends here, so please, if you have questions, kind of key them up.  I want to make sure that we're giving opportunities for you to ask questions about the ABLE collaboration, about ABLE plans overall or very specific questions that you have about ABLE.  This is a great picture from our wonderful partners there in the state of Maryland.  And basically, it's just to show you that we work really, really hard to make sure we are talking to our state legislators and federal legislators to make sure savings plans are even more open and more accessible for more people.  In the past we were successful to allowing what's called ABLE to work, which allows people who have ABLE savings plans who work to put in more money each year than what they would be able to put in some if he weren't working of it's a way to save for their retirement and life in the future.  We successfully got the ability to roll money over from a college savings plan into an ABLE savings plan.  We knew which was parent for some individuals and some families, and we're working especially hard and tirelessly to pass what's call the ABLE age adjustment.  This has not passed yet.  We are really hopeful, there is a lot of support behind this, and there is a lot of nuance and things that have to happen to make this come into play.
Let me explain this just for a moment.  We didn't get into the details of who is eligible for an ABLE savings plan in this presentation, balls as Miranda mentioned at the beginning, this is supposed to be a deep dive for individuals that may have a basic understanding of ABLE.  But for anybody that doesn't on this presentation, let me just explain.  One of the things that you have to become eligible to open up an ABLE savings plan, one is the severity of the disability.  It's really tied for your ability to get benefits, social security or Medicaid benefits.  It's very specifically tied to what's called the Blue Book on disabilities that's put out by social security.  One of the is the severity of the disability.
The other is the age at which the disability started.  It's called the age of onset.  And so this is very arbitrary.  For someone to be qualifying for an ABLE savings plan, their disability had to start before their 26th birthday.  And for many people with disabilities, they still fit.  Either they were born with the disability itself, or it started in their younger years, but for somebody who had a disability start after the age of 26, just because of when that started, they're not able to use that ABLE savings plan.  So we're working really hard with, again, state legislators and federal legislators to pass what's call the ABLE age adjustment that would move that from 26 to 46, so anybody who had a disability start before the age of 46 would then qualify.
Now, I just want to remind people, this has not passed yet, although there is a lot of wonderful support for this.  And we're going to work tirelessly, all of the ABLE collaboration states and all of the ABLE states in general are going to work really hard to make sure that we show everybody that we have the support of this policy and many others.  Miranda, if we can go to the next slide, please?
I just wanted to say thank you and maybe wrap up with a few closing comments before we dive into some of the questions that may have been asked.  We do have time to cover this.  I really want to thank the national Disability Institute, and specifically the ABLE National Resource Center, for putting on these spotlights and webinars that allow us to dive into the details of the ABLE savings plans.  I want to thank all of the great states out there that are offering ABLE savings plans and most importantly all of the savings that are trusting them to save with us are gate partners and so much more.  I spent a lot of time today talking about the ABLE collaboration, because that's the collaboration that I'm part of and I love the States and I feel like we offer some of the best savings plans in the nation, but I also want to thank all of the incredible states out there, because they're doing great things to make sure you have savings opportunities for you.  If you saw key aspects of what you liked here or didn't like here, we're always open to those ideas and thoughts so we can make these savings plans even better.  So I think this is a good time for us, Miranda, to jump into some questions that individuals may have that didn't get answered through the Q&A.  So I'll turn it back over to you, and thank you for this opportunity.
>> Miranda:  Yeah.  Hi.  This was great, David.  And I really ‑‑ we have a number of folks who are on.  We have 15 more minutes for questions.  We have a few resource slides as well that were referenced throughout today's presentation and discussion.  But let's dive in.  We've had our team has been answering a number of questions in the Q&A.  Anything that is basic to ABLE and all ABLE programs, you all would have gotten some responses from our subject matter experts.  They've also been, anything that's specific to Oregon or Washington, Maryland, Hawaii, or Alabama, or the collaboration, they've been working on putting those, sending those to us, and we're going to dive into a few of these questions here and now.  We know they wouldn't have been answered potentially.
Here's one of the first questions.  Does the collaboration have any intention of partnering with Connecticut or any other state?
>> David:  Well, we love the state of Connecticut.  In fact, actually, we were really, really close to the individuals that were establishing the ABLE plan in the state of Connecticut.  I can tell you the state of Connecticut is part of a partnership model.  I'll not the collaboration model, but that's okay, because the other models are fantastic as well.  I guess I should say specifically for the state of Connecticut, there's no discussion with them right now about joining the collaboration.  I think they're very happy with the partnership that they're in right now.  But we're always open to discussions with anybody that may be interested, but again, I must highlight, from what I can tell, the Connecticut ABLE savings plan is a really strong, really good opportunity.
We are interested in talking with other states, but really, I feel like states are in good spots.  We really only want to start adding people to the ABLE collaboration or, excuse me, states to the ABLE collaboration if they see that there's certain resources or features or benefits that we can offer that they can't get where they're at.  And so no, we're not actively trying to recruited more states.  We literally will only start talking to a state if they feel like it's a good fit for them.
>> Miranda:  I was wondering in terms of that question.  It was the first one that got 70 our way, David, but it could also be ‑‑ Hawaii is a new program and they've joined your collaboration, but Alabama had also found they had been pursuing their plan and decided to roll in, too.  So there is some flexibility, too, in the States.  And that might have been where people were coming from, seeing that, because that was two different ways of coming at it.  The two newest folks who just joined you this year.
>> David:  That's actually a really interesting point and 1 worth talking about here a little bit.  All of our ABLE collaboration states were ones that were brand flu to the ABLE sphere, except for Alabama.  And so yes, we do have the opportunities to become new states that are either doing it on their own or that are part of other partnerships, but again, I think Alabama had a great partnership previously and for different reasons, they decided that they wanted to move to the ABLE collaboration, but you're right.  There are many different models.  And I think ABLE is going to continue to grow and perfect itself and get better for the saver, so I think two, three, five years down the road things will just look very different, which is exciting, because it means it will be better for those saves.
>> Miranda:  It also brings to mind, I think it was back in 2019, we first did a spotlight with ABLE collaboration, which at the time was just Oregon‑led with Washington and Maryland and now we decided to redo this, and we're actually going to be revisiting and speaking to those other multi‑state collaborations and other individual states and doing more program spotlights moving forward.  So the collaboration that Connecticut is part of, we hope to invite and have a spotlight with them next year, as well as the others.  So Stay tuned to ABLE NRC webinars.  You've been doing a beautiful job plugging us, David.
Let's move forward and continue with some of the other questions that have rolled in.  There's some good questions.  I think some of these you did answer during the course of your presentation, but it might be worth just quickly revisiting.  The next question, if needed, how would someone make deposits this and withdrawals since the account is an online account?  I know you provided information on those links, but it sounds like someone who is maybe new to online banking in and that concept?
>> David:  Actually, it is new for a lot of us.  So we actually try to make it extremely easy for people to put money in or take money out of their accounts of the most popular way, the most ‑‑ the way that most people put money into their ABLE account is they link their bank account electronically to their ABLE account.  Now, that doesn't mean that ABLE account can see into your bank account.  This is really secure.  But what you do when you're opening up your ABLE savings plan or later on after, you can seamlessly, very easily link those two savings plans, your ABLE savings plan and your bank together, and you can do that with multiple banks.  In fact, some of our savers have three or four bank accounts linked to one ABLE accounts, because maybe they have two bank accounts that put money into the ABLE account and one that comes out.  And so basically, what you would do is you link those bank accounts and then just with a few clicks of the button, you can say, I want to move $50 from my ABLE account into this bank account or this savings Account, either at your local bank or your local credit union.
Now, the exciting thing here is that because the money was in ABLE and was protected against those resource limits in ABLE, even when you move it out to your bank account, that money is still protected.  Even like it was still in ABLE.  The only caveat here, and now I'm kinds of moving into the ABLE 101 discussion, and I won't go into too much detail.  The only caveat is if you do take money out of your ABLE to be used on your house or upgrades or your mortgage, you want to spends that money the same month you pull it out of ABLE.  Any other amount you pull out of ABLE, you can let it sit in your bank account for a while as you spends it down or as you prepare for that purchase.  We make it very easy.
You can also request to have a check sent to you if you'd rather do that or send be a check in.  Again, there's the prepaid card that's an easy way to pulmonary I out.  We try to make it very easy for people to put money in and out of the ABLE account.
>> Miranda:  and this information would be pretty clear in disclosure documents and information you provide on your website.  Right.  David?
>> David:  Straight on on the website.  The disclosure accidents are pretty heavy and thick, because they're legal documents.  All of the ABLE states have worked to make them very usable, like a tool.  So if you go to the bottom of most all of our websites, well, all of the ABLE collaboration, but even all of the other state sites, you'll usually see what's called a program disclosure booklet.  That's like your comprehensive guide on how it works.  But you can just go around the website itself.  We usually do a good job of explaining how to put money in and out just right there on the website.
>> Miranda:  Great.  Thank you, David.  Another thing that I rolled into the Q&A for us would be let's just clarify in terms of non‑ABLE gifts.  Do those count against the $15,000 contribution limit?
>> David:  Non‑ABLE gifts?  Okay.  That's a very key ‑‑ I'm going to try to answer this.  Miranda, if I don't do a good job or if the individual that's asking this, please type back in and we'll try to address this.  This is important.  Let's just say that my daughter has an ABLE account and my parents want to gift her 134 money.  If they gave my daughter a check that she had to cash and put into her own bank account before putting it into her ABLE account, that's going to count against her and some resource opportunities.  That's why we build out some opportunities for people to gift money straight into an ABLE accounts.  I think I'm going to try to address that question this way.  If someone is given money as a gift to somebody and it was not going straight into their ABLE Account, yes, it can affect their resource limits.  That's why so many ABLE plans created options for his people to gift money straight into that ABLE account be, and once it's in that ABLE account, they can pull it out and use it the way they need to and it's not going to count against their resource limits.
Miranda, did you want to add anything to this answer?
>> Miranda:  I know Marlene had submitted that from our team.  It was a little bit unclear, butted it would certainly counts against the $2,000 resource limit for folks who receive federal means tested benefits.  So Marlene, you might even provide some additional feedback in the chat around that.  There was more to that question that you were sending over to us?  We just want to be real clear on that, especially for the person who posted it as well.
>> David:  Thank you.
>> Miranda:  Let's move while we're waiting for feedback on that to see if some of the other questions were fees.  Like what's the monthly fee?  It was a $35 annual fee.  You said there's a portion of that that comes up quarterly, though?  The total for the annual, but someone was asking what the monthly fee was.  Does it come out monthly or quarterly?
>> David:  It actually comes out quarterly.  So $35 divided by four had, so that's quarterly throughout the year, is $8.75.  So people that are saving with the ABLE collaboration, once a quarter, they'll see $8.75 plus a very tiny bit more of that, which is that asset, that percentage fee, they would see that come out every quarter.  And that covers the fee.  So you don't actually have to send them a check or remember to pay, but yes, that $35 comes out quarterly, $8.75.  What they may be asking as well is for ourselves plans and others, not all, there's an additional fee university for the free paid card.  There is an additional fee for the able card itself, and in that case, it is a monthly fee that comes out of their ABLE savings plan and it's $1.25 a month.
>> Miranda:  Any changes or updates to that, we have an ABLE program comparison tool for the over 40, I think it's 46 now, state ABLE programs, plus D.C., that folks can look at.  We have kind of the top 13 questions.  You can compare and dive in deep her.  Take a look at your home state first of there's many out there that also might be a good fit, and it's on our home page of our website, our comparison tools.
Here's another question.  A beneficiary in terms of investment options could contribute 10% to conservative, 30% to moderate, and a percent to aggressive at one time?
>> David:  They can choose different places to put their money, exactly.  Our programs currently do it exactly like you said, a percentage basis.  They may want to choose 50% of the money goes to the cash and 50% goes into the good rat's.  We're making changes new in a very positive way that still bets feel choose different ways of saving their money, but gives them more power.  So starting in December when somebody contributes money or takes money out of their ABLE plan, every time they do that, they can say today I want all my money going into the moderate.  And tomorrow when I put money in, I want half of it to go into moderate's and half of it to go into the savings option.  And then when you pulmonary I out, even more importantly, when they pulmonary I out, they may only want it to come out of the cash option and not the investment option.  So you're absolutely right.  We try to give people the power to direct where they're putting the money in and where they're taking it out.
>> Miranda:  and I think that's really important to state as well, because for many people, you know, moving into what choices am I making in terms of investments.  This might be the fit opportunity they have to make investment choices.  There's that flexibilities to practice that out.  I'm thinking of someone I know as one of our first ambassadors back in 2018 with the Oregon plan, David, that actually lived in a different state and we want with Oregon.  They'd never done investment before.  They put 70% into that FDIC ensured side and 30% they put into investments, and then that kind of helped them get their feet wet a little, because another really key point is that, you know, you have an opportunity to have your money make money and also, you could potentially lose that money.  That money is not guaranteed to be there.  There are the potential for losses, as well as gains.  So just factoring that in is important for folks to know.
>> David:  Absolutely.  Miranda, can I articulate a little bit more about that $15,000 a year as a gift?  Because I think we didn't get the question right.
>> Miranda:  I think we didn't either.
>> David:  I think the question, and I appreciate this to the person that asked it, to clarify it, I believe the question was around if somebody else is gifting to your ABLE account, does it count toward the $15,000 annual contribution limit for ABLE?
>> Miranda:  Yeah.
>> David:  And the answer is unfortunately, yes.  Any money going into an individual's savings plan, there is a limit on total contribution, whether by a person themselves or a family member or loved one or gift.  So yes.  If somebody put money into your ABLE account, it's going to counts be against your $15,000 annual contribution limit.  We are lucky that in 2022 next year, that goes up to 16,000.  But yes, it does count against your contribution.
>> Miranda:  if you spend that money down, so say you put $15,000 in and you spent down and got down to ten, that doesn't mean you can put another five in toward the end of the year.  That's the total amount of contributions you can put in towards the year.  One question here, can we get a direct representative that will walk with us on a daily basis.  I think they mean talk.  Not a walking Buddy.  But have folks that they can talk to?   
>> David:  I like talking, too, but I can't confirm welds do that.  There are two sets of individuals who work with people who need more individual about the savings plan.  And I have to say the best place for most savers to go immediately is to go straight to the call center or the service center, which is the main phone number that's listed on the website.  And I say that not to try to just pass this off to the service center.  I say that, because that service center can actually get into people's accounts with them, see what the issues are, help them resolve those issues immediately in a way that some of us that also help individuals cannot see.  I oversee, my team oversees the Oregon ABLE savings plan and the ABLE for all savings plan, but if someone came to me and said, can you look into my account and see what's happening?  I don't have that ability.  Our partners at someday do and their service representatives do.  Those are the best to serve them.  But to say that, most states, especially most states in the collaboration, and I know others as well, have one or two or three people that work for the state, in our case it's the Oregon Treasury Savings Network, that will help individuals walk‑through specific scenarios that they may need help with, talk through with them, make sure they have their questions asked.  And the best way to get in touch with those individuals is to go to your ABLE savings plan site and either it's listed there or you can call the service center and see if you can be put in touch with the individual that might be able to help them in their own state.
>> Miranda:  I love how you incorporated walking through the options.  Okay.  David day I did my best.
>> Miranda:  That was great.  Very goods.  So I've got another one.  Aloha from Hawaii.  I was wondering is the ABLE savings and investment portfolio part of the same account or separate?  Also, can I sign up on the Hawai'iABLE website?
>> David:  Aloha.  We are so excited that the Hawaii ABLE Savings Program is up now.  Let me answer the first part.  Yes, we are all able to sign up.  It's Hawai'iABLE savings.com.  It's beautiful.  Get all sorts of supports from your state there.  So please do that if you feel like that's the best savings plan for you, and I think it is, because you live in Hawaii.  But the answer is it's all part of the same program or same plan.  Whether you choose the cash option or the investment option or a combination of the two, it's going into your ABLE account, which is part of a wider trust.  I'm not going to get into the details behind this, but it's all part of the same thing, which there's some benefits to that of it's easy access for you to get that money out, regardless of where you want to pull that money from or put it or if you want to move some money around within there.  So yes, it's all part of the same thing.  Even if you choose cash versus investment.  But we, then, I believe vest your money or save your money differently, did he pens being on how you want to use it.  If you want 50% of your money in the cash option, we'll make sure that 50% is there and 50% is an investment option or vice versa.  We're following your lead on this, but it's all part of the same plan.
>> Miranda: And I've got a quick yes or no question for you.  Is Hawaii eligible for the prepaid card as well?
>> David:  Yes, absolutely.
>> Miranda:  I'm looking through.  Are there any limits to how often a saver can make a withdrawal from their ABLE account?
>> David:  No, there's no limits.  These need to be very transactional accounts, so people can take money out as soon as they or whenever they need it.  I would suggest, though, depending on the way that you're taking money out, you might want to plan ahead a little bit.  Think about the facts that you are ‑‑ let's say you go online and you say, I want $25 or $50 taken out of my ABLE account or $500.  Doesn't matter how much.  And placed into my bank accounted.  It might take a couple of business days.  Now, we'll process that on the same day, but it might take a couple of business days do the money to get from your ABLE accounts to the bank account and available for you to use it there.  Same thing with the prepaid card.  I would suggest not waiting until the last minute.  Look on the website to see how much delay is in there.  But yes, you can move as much as you wanted.  Just know that it might take a little bit of time to get there.  The
>> Miranda:  Okay.  Great.  You know, we are coming up against our time here.  75 minutes.  One other quick question was just ‑‑ that came is, is this being recorded and will it be available?  It will be archived on our website.  We will also share it with the ABLE collaboration for them to share and link to.  It will be going out in our newsletter that will be going out.  So there's lots of ways to get access to this archived webinar, including on our website where our spotlights are posted.  If you didn't, as I'm going to be wrapping up and just sharing a couple key resource slides that we reference that might also help folks get some deeper answers, but I wanted to let everyone know that ‑‑ let's see.  As we move forward here, I want to share just a couple of slides, but also, if you didn't get any of your questions answered, we have a post events survey, and what I would ask you to do is just in the other comment, you can put your question in the other comments and put your e‑mail address, and we will get those questions to David.  So that's another opportunity if you think of something later, you can also e‑mail us@info@able NRC.org or reach out directly to the ABLE Collaboration to David with those questions.  There's lots of opportunities.  We hope more questions will come up.  We want to you keep exploring this.
In terms of just a couple of other resources, our ABLE NRC webinars are available.  We also have an ability to compare ABLE plans.  These are all links on our site.  We have our ABLE decision guides, as well as your frequently asked questions and ABLE accounts and special needs trusts and pooled trusts.  So those are all wonderful links and resources that we have.  We have many more, but we thought these might be somewhat relevant to you after today's presentation.
Also wants to mention, our partner center under national Disability Institute, ABLE National Resource Center is managed by national Disability Institute, which is the only national nonprofit exclusively focused on increasing the financial capability of people with disabilities, little April before last when we were moving into Covid and experiencing that, we got funding to support and build out the financial resilience center.  So if you have needs, certainly many of us do for our resources and updated information and strategies for people with disabilities and chronic health conditions, especially under Covid, you can check out the financial resilience center.  Please do check out those resources.  We go back and forth with them a great deal.
And we would also ask that you just help spread the word for those of you who joined us here today.  Get this information out to your contacts, your friends and family, your community groups that you're a part of who could also benefit from this.  And you can sign up for our newsletter as well.  That's also on our home page of our website.  It's callous the AchievABLE newsletter.  It's chockful of information, tools, strategies, stories, podcasts, blogs, everything you could want.  And you can also participate and continue to participate in our webinars and follow us on social media using@the able NRC.  And we want to thank all of you and thank David Bell and the ABLE collaboration for joining us here today.  Please take just a moment to fill out that post event survey.  We really appreciate your feedback.  We want to hear from you.  Was this helpful for you somewhat other questions do you have or suggestions?  We're open to hearing from that and we appreciate all of you being here with us today and wish you well, wish you a good rest of your day and weekend at this so much.  Have a good day.
[Event Concludes]
 
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